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NOMINATIONS OF HENRY C. WALLICH, IRVING M. POLLACK AND JEROME W. VAN GORKOM HEARING BEFORE THE COMMITTEE ON BANKING. HOUSING AND URBAN AFFAIRS UNITED STATES SENATE NINETY-THIRD CONGRESS SECOXD SESSIOX ON THE NO~II;XATIONS OJ<' HENRY C. WALLICH TO BE A l\IE~IBER OF THE BOARD OF GO\"ERNORS OF THE FEDERAL RESERVE SYSTI<~~I, IRVING ~L POLLACK 'I'O BE A l\IE:\IBER OF THE SECURITIES AND EXCHANGE CO:\DIISSIOX. AND JEROME W. VAN GORKOM TO BE A DIRECTOR OF THE SECURI'I'IES INVESTOR PROTECTION CORPORATION FEBRUARY 7, 1974 Printed for the use of the Committee on Banking. Housing and Urban Affairs U.S. GOVERNMENT PRINTING OFFICE 2!H08 WASHINGTON : 1974 CO}lMITTEE ON BANKING, HOUSING AND URBAN AFFAIRS JOHN SPARKMAN, Alabama, Chairman WILLIAM PROXMIRE, Wisconsin JOHN TOWER, Texas HARRISON A. WILLIAMS, JR., New Jersey WALLACE F . BENNETT, Utah THOMAS J. McINTYRE, New Hampshire EDWARD W. BROOKE, Massachusetts ALAN CRANSTON, Cali(ornia BOB PACKWOOD, Oregon ADLAI E. STEVENSON Ill, Illinois BILL BROCK, Tennessee J. BENNETT JOHNSTON, JR., Louisiana LOWELL P. WEICKER, JR. , Connecticut WILLIAM D. HATHAWAY, Maine JOSEPH R. BIDEN, JR., Delaware DVDLEY L. O'NEAL, Jr., Staff Dirrctor and General Coumel WM. HOWARD BEASLEY Ill, Director of MinorUv Staff (Il) Digitized by Google NOMINATIONSOF HENRYC. WALLICH,IRVING M. POLLACK,AND JEROMEW. VAN GORKOM THURSDAY, FEBRUARY 7, 1974 U.S. SENATE, COMMITTEE ONBANKING,HOUSING ANDURBANAFFAIRS, Washington,D.O. The committee met at 9:30 a..m., pursuant to call, in room 5302, Dirksen Building, Sena.torJohn Sparkman, chairman of the committee, presiding. Present: Senators Sparkman, Prmanire, Biden, Brooke, B.rock, and Weicker. The CHAIRMAN.Let the committee come to order, please. We have three candidates for confirmation. I would like for us to complete this hearing so that we can move right into the housing markup at 10 o'clock. Even though we don't have many members here yet I think we had better proceed. They will be in. At least pracfi.cally all of the members have promised to come. Three cannot be here but we will move ahead. We are meeting for the purpose of holding hearings on three nominations that have been sent to the Senate by the President. The fir.:;t is Mr . Henry C. Wallich; the second is Ylr. Irving M. Pollack; and the third is Mr. Jerome W. Van Gorkom. Mr. Henry C. Widlich of·Connecticut is nominated to be. a member of the Board of Governors of the Federal Reserve Svstem for a term of 14 years starting February 1, 1974. Mr. Wallich, we are very glad to have you . We have approval by both the Senator;;from Connecticut. Let me ask you a few questions. Have you filed a financial repo t with the committee? . Mr. WALLICH.Yes, I have it here, Mr. Chairman. The CHAIRMAN.Very well. Mr. W ALLICH. The relevant passageto look at is page 4 of Mr. O'Connell's memorandum, Mr. Chairman. The CHAIRMAN . Do you have a letter from counsel regarding it? Mr. W ALLICH.Yes, I do. The CHAIRMAN.Counsel of the Federal Reserve Board? Mr. W ALLICH.Yes, sir. The CHAIRMAN.Here it is, signed by Thomas J. O'Connell, General Counsel. Let me read the concluding para.graphof that: "Accordingly, once the committed positions have been achieved by and on behalf of Dr. Wallich, I am s11.tisfied that no ownerships, interests, or activities by or involving Dr. Wallich will present any conflict with, or impediment to, Dr . Wallich's service as a member of the Board of Governors and of the Federal Open Market Committee." I 1J Digitized by Google J 2 Can you tell us in just a few words what those commitments are? Mr. W ALLICH.Yes. I have been engagedin writing several books. I am a professor at Yale and I am writing one book that has been going on for far too long, on comparison of monetary systems. There's a se~on1 book! done by and under the sponsorship ol the Brookings IMtitut10n which covers the economy of Japan. I contribute a chapter on Japanesebanking. There are minor articles and things of that order that a professo~normal~y has in the works. Those I'm going to be allowed, accordmg to this memorandum, to complete. It would be a v~ry unfortunate breach in my undertakings with the sponsors if I didn't complete them. The CHAIR:\IAN.And that has all been discussedand cleared with the General Counsel? Mr. WALl,.ICH.Yes, it has. The CHAIRxrA~.And will you tell us, this committee, in your opinion do vou have anv mterests, anv holdings, that would in any way conflict \\;ith your holding this office·if vou are confirmed? Mr. WALLICH.None after the actions that I'm comP.letingnow. ' .The 9HAIR:\IAN.And you have assumedthe responsibility of taking the action that the General Counsel has recommended? Mr. WALLICH.Yes, sir . The CHAIRxlAN.Now one other question I want to ask you and we ask this of everyone up here before us. If you're confirmed in this position will you be ready to respond to requests from this committee or any other appropriate committee of Congressto appear before the committee and testify without reservation? Mr. W ALLICH.Yes, I certainly would, Mr. Chairman. The CHAIRMAN.Senator Proxmire. May I say that we have Mr. Wallich's biographical sketch and that will be included in the record. [Biographical sketch follows.] BIOGRAPHICAL SKETCH OF HENRY C. WALLICH . Dr. Wallich is the Seymour H. Knox Professorof Economics at Yale University, where he has been a teacher since 19.'H. He is a former member of the Council of Economic Advisers (May 19i>9-January 1961), and served as Assistant to the Secretary of the Treasury (SeRtember 19f>8-May 1959), and with the Federal Resnve Bank of New York (June 1941-September 19.51). Born in Germany in 1914, he became a U.S. citizen in 1944. His formal education, begun in Germany, included studies at Oxford University in England, and led to a masters degree from New York Univer sity and a Ph. D. degree from Harvard in 1944. Before joining th e staff of the Federal Reserve- Bank of New York in 1941, Dr. Wallich was associated with private firms in Latin America and New York Citv. Since 1969, Dr. Wallich has been a senior consultant for the Treasury Department. He has also serv€d with the Advisory Board of the Arms Control and Diimrmament Agency (1972-1973) and as the U.S. Representative on the United Nations Experts Panel on Economic Consequencesof.the Arms Race (1971-1972). He is a director of several businessfirms and has served on the R esearch Advisory Board of the Committee for Economic Development from time to time. since 1951. : :His published works include four books and numerous articles in economic and financial journals dealing, among other things, with monetary policy, the international payments system, and·our financial structure. From 1961 to 1964, he was an editorial writer for the Washington Post; since 1965 he has been a columnist for Newsweek Magazine. '. He is married and has three children. Digitized by Google 3 Senator PROXMIRE.Dr. Wallich, you served on the Council of Economic Advisers under President Eisenhower; is that correct? Mr. W ALLICH.That is right, Senator Proxmire. Senator PROXMIRE.I know of your distinguished record as an economist. You are one of the ablest economistsin the country. You have served with great distinction in various capacitiesfor the Government. We are fortunate that you have agreed to serve on the Federal Reserve· Board for the 14 years. This is one of the best appointments that President Nixon has made. I have been urging that the appointments to the Federal Reserve Board be of competent economists and I am just delighted to see a man of your stature has received the appointment. Incidentally, I have received letters from some of the most outstanding economists in the country, some of whom disagree with some of your positions and policies in economics, but all of whom unanimously feel that you are a very distinguished choice and will serve this country well as a member of the Federal Reserve Board. I am just delighted that you have been appointed. Mr. W ALLICH. I'm very happy to hear that. Thank you, Senator, The CHAIRMAN.Senator Brooke. Senator BROOKE.Mr. Chairman, Senator Tower unfortunately, could not be here this morning, but he did want me to expresshis appreciation to the President for the quality of this appointment. He, as I am, is well aware of your very distinguished career,as Senator Proxmire has pointed out, as truly one of the leading economists in this country and perhaps in the world, and we feel that the adminis.:. tration and the country is fortunate to have you comeinto government and serve in this capacity We also have had the benefit of re11dingthe statement discussing your nomination by the distinguished Senator from Connecticut, Senator Weicker. He has come into the room and we look forward to a long and distinguished career in government. We welcome you and we are very proud to ca,st a vote for your confirmation Mr. WALLICH. Thank you ver-y much. Senator Brooke, I feel somewhat humbled by these compliments and I will do my best. The CHAIR:'IIAN.Mr. Weicker:Senator WEICKER Mr Chairmfln, I'm delighted to vote for Dr. W allich's confirmation and as I said to him when we met just a few minutes ago in my office I would only hope that he would have some input. It's fine to have these credentials and he certainly has those, and he has a fine mind and I think he will make a very positive contribution. I just hope that he will be allowed to make that contribution rather than being just named, and he assured me that in every way possible he would bring his views to bear on our economic problems as they relate to this particular position. The CHAIR:\IAN.Thank you very much, Mr. Wallich, and we wish you well. Mr. W ALLICH.Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman. The CHAIRMAN . We shall hope to be seeingyou from time to time up here. Mr. W ALLICH. Yes, sir. The CHAIRMAN.Next is Mr. Irving M. Pollack, of Maryland, to be a member of the Securities and Exchange Commission for a term ex- Digitized by Google 4 piring June 5, 1975, to succeedMr Hugh F. Owens who has resigned. Mr ..Pollack, we are very glad to have you here, sir. Do we have your financial statement? Mr. POLLACK.Yes, sir. The Cmum,lAN. You have a letter signed by the general counsel of the Securities and Exchange Commission and he says, "I found nothinO' in said statements whid1 does not fully comply with the requirement~ of that Executive order that relates to conflicts of interest." I will ask you, do you have any interests or any holding of any kind that would constitute a conflict of interest in holding this office if you are confirmed? Mr. POLLACK.No, sir. The CHAIRMAN.Will you stand ready to accept a request from this committee and any other appropriate committee of Congress to appear and testify without reservntion at any time? Mr . POLLACK.I have and I will. The·CHAIR'.IIAN. We have your biographical sketch. That will be placed in the record, together ,,;th some additional letters and newspaEer articles we've received. [The information follows:] BIOGRAPHICALSKETCH OF IRVING M. POLLACK Mr. Pollack hns been on the stnff of the Securities and Exchange Commission since 1946 and has been Director of the Division of Enforcement since September 1972. He had previously served as an attorney with the Office of the Solicitor (1946-48), attorney-adviser with the Office of the General Counsel (1948-57), Assistant General Counsel (1957-61), Associate Director of the Division of Trading and Markets (1961-6,j) and Director of the Division of Trading and Markets (1965-72). He was born on April 8, 1918, in Brooklyn, New York. Mr. Pollack received his B.A. degree, cum laude, from Brooklyn College in 1938 and his LL.B., magna cum laude, from Brooklyn L:nv School in 1942. After serving from 1942 to 1946 as an officer in the U.S. Army, he was an attorney with the New York law firm of Nathan L. Goldstein during 1946. · Mr. Pollack was the 1968 recipient of the Rockefeller Public Service Award in the field of law, legislation or regulation, and the 1967 SEC Distinguished Service Award for outstanding career service. He is a member of the Federal Bar Association. CONGRESSOF THE UNITED STATES, HOUSE OF Rr.PRESF.NTATIVES, Washington, D.C., February 7, 1974. Hon. JOHN SP,\RKMA~, Chairman, Ba11ki11g, Housing and Urban Affairs Commitlee, 5300 Dirksen SenateOffice Building, Washington, D.C. DEAR MR. CHAIRMAN: I applaud President Nixon's nomination of Irving M. Pollack as a Commissioner to the Securities and Exchange Commission. I consider his nomination to this highly important commission a noteworthy one. It elevates to a vital and sensitive agency of the Federal government a person of exceptional ability, industry and integrity. Mr. Pollack is a career executive who has worked his way to the top by brilliant, dedicated service. Appointed to the staff of the general counsel in 1946, his outstanding service over the years resulted in successive promotions to high level positions with the Commission-1961 associate director of the Division of Trading and Markets-1965 director of that division-in the reorganization of the Commission in 1972, director of the Division of Enforcement in which capacity he now serves. Irving Pollack has appeared many times before the Committee on Appropriations in connection with it,; annual budg et presentation to the Congress. He is well and favorably known to many l\lembers of the Congress. He is highly respected Digitized by Google 5 by the appropriations subcommittee which I chair as an extremely capable program manager. From my own personal observation of his ability, vast knowledge and expertise of the securities industry, I am confident that the public, the government and the industry will be well served by the splendid attributes he possesses . Mr. Chairman, this career appointment is a fitting reward for a person of recognized ability. The Federal government needs public servants like Irving Pollack who give so generously and unselfishly of their time, effort and dedication to the commonweal. In this day, the Securities and Exchange Commission deservesthe best. It gets it in the appointment of Mr. Pollack. I urge this committee to recommend his confirmation by the United States Senate. Sincerely yours, EDWARDP. BOLAND, Memberof Conaress. CONGRESS OF THE UNITED STATES, HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES, Washington,D.C., February 6, 1974, Hon. JOHNSPARKMAN, Chairman, Committeeon Banking, Housing and Urban Affairs, New SenateOffice Building, Washington,D.C. DEAR MR. CHAIRMAN:This letter is to urge the speedyconfirmation of Irving M. Pollack as a Commissioner of the Securities and Exchange Commission. Mr. Pollack is a long-time federal servant, having served on the staff of the Securities and Exchange Commission for 27 years. During that time he has built an extraordinary reputation for himself as being a thoroughly competent, honest and fair administrator of the Federal Securities Laws. This was recognized just 6 years ago when Mr. Pollack was awarded the Rockefeller Public Service Award for his distinguished federal service in the field of law, legislation or regulation. The inscription on that award reads: "In recognition of more than two decades of singular achievements and notable contributions to the cause of investor protection and the preservation of investor confidence in the integrity of the capital markets of the nation." • · As Chairman of the House Subcommittee with legislative oversight responsibility of the Securities and Exchange Commission, I have had the pleasure of working with Mr. Pollack on numerous occasions. I always found him to be extremely cooperative and most helpful to the Subcommittee and its staff . I cannot remember an occasion when Mr. Pollack's appearance before us did not help to make clear the issuesunder discussion. Mr. Pollack's nomination to the Commission is a truly outstanding appointment, and I urge his speedy confirmation by the Senate. Sincerely, JoHN E. Moss, Chairman, Subcommittee on Commerceand Finance. INDEPENDENTBROKERDt:ALERS TRADE ASSOCIATION, Washington,D.C., February 2, 1974, Senator EDWARD\V. BROOKE, Committeeon Banking, Housing and Urban Affairs, U.S. Senate,Dirksen Building, Washington,D.C. DE.\R SF.NATOR: The Committee on Banking, Housing and Urban Affairs will soon corn,iderIrving M. Pollack for the position of Commissioner of the Securities and Exchange Commis!'ion. We heartily support his nomination for this most important position . Unfortunately, a few so-called industry spokesmen belonging to the Wall Street crowd have created an illusion that there is broad industry opposition to Mr. Pollack's appointment, as reported in the attached Wall Str eet Journal article of January 31, 1974. Members of our organization resent this broad brush treatment. Digitized by Google 6 To the contrary, our nation's 30 million investors and the three thousand securities firms operating outside of Wall Street will benefit from the tough, but fair, policy and the enormous practical experience that Mr. Pollack will add to the Commission. As a member of the Committee we hope you will support Mr. Poll ack's confirmation at the Hearings, and urge your colleagues to do the same. Sincerely, RAYMOND W. Coccm, President. [From the Wall Street Journal] N1xoN APPOINTS SEC's ENFORCEMENTCHIEF TO AGENCY SF-AT DESPITE INDUSTRYOPPOSITION WASHINGTON-President Nixon named Irving M. Pollack, director of the Securities and Exchange Commission 's enforcement divi:-ion, to a seat on the panel. The appointmPnt, which was expected, wns mnde dc'spit e what SEC and Capitol Hill officinls c:1lled strong securities industry oppo,-;i\ion to Mr. Pollack, who has made some enemies during his nine years as the agency's enforcement chief. SUPPORTFROM GARRF.TT In addition, Wall Street hnd urged President Nixon to appoint a stock exchange or brokernge firm official to the SEC, which is pressing ahead with plans to restructure the stock m arkets. The industry had hoped for a sympathetic ear on the five-memb er commission. But Mr. Pollack had strong suoport from SEC Chairman Ray Garrett Jr . and the three other commis:-ioners, who thought his <'nforc<'ment experience during a 27-year SEC career would round out the commis~inn. Th<' current µnnd comprises three former securities l nwyers and an economist, three of whom have sat on the panel for less than a year. BLOTSON SEC1 S RECORD Mr. Pollack, a 5.5-year-old Democrat, mu st be confirm<'d by the Senate. He will replace Hugh F. Owens, who left the commission in November to head Securities Investor Protection Corp., and will r et urn the SEC's political makeup to three Republicans and two D emocrats . S8C conunis~ioners enrn $38,000 a year. The Pollack appointment should help erase blots on the SEC's reputation that resulted from charges G. Bradford Cook, Mr. Garrett's pr edecessor af; chairman, performed political favors for the Nixon administrntion . In fact, Mr . Pollack and his division brought the multimillion dolbr fraud charges against New Jer:aey financi er Robert L. Vesco thnt ultimately l ed to the resignation of Mr. Cook. He quit in May after a federal grand jury said he yi<'lded to political pressure to delete from an SEC complaint against Mr. Vesco a reference to a sum of money from which, it turned out, Mr. Vesco made a secret cash contribution to Mr. Nixon's reelection campaign. Mr. Cook d enied any wrongdoing and wnsn't , charged with a crime. Stanley Sporkin, Mr . Pollack's deputy, is expected to follow him as head of the enforcement division. [From Time l\Iagazlne, Feb. 11, 1974] MAIGRET OF THE SEC His name is Irving M. Pollack, but to his staff he i;; "Irv." He oft.en answers his own phone. His clothes appear to come from off the rack at Macy•~ - Peering into a legal brief through smudged spectacles, he looks like a bookkeeper on his way to nowhere. But he has long been the Securities and Exchange Commission's top cop as head of its tough Division of Enforcement and previously chief of its Division of Trading and Markets. Last week President Nixon promoted Lawyer Pollack (magna cum laude, Brooklyn Law School) to become one of the SEC's five commissioners. He had been passed over for a commissioner's job two or three times before in his 27-year SEC career, largely because he has not built a political bas<' b~· cultivating Congressmen or influensial Wall Streeters. Now, with the Administration Digitized by Google 7 struggling to restore confidence in Government and the SEC striving to revive faith in the securities markets. Pollack's moment has come. Says an SEC staffer: " Because of Watergate, the Administration had to come up with a completely honest guy." Pollack, 55, never acceptseven a free lunch from anyone in the securities business. He lives in a modest house that he bought in 1956 for $18,500. If he left Government, he could easily multiply his salary of $36,000; as a commissioner, he will get a raise-of $2,000. KNACK FOR NAILING Pollack has been centrally involved at the commission in moves to reform the market system and protect investors. Instead of wasting resourcestrying to track down small-time securities sharpies, he has concentrated on nailing the big operators, and he has shown a knack for it that would be worthy of the fictional Inspector Maigret, another unprepossessingsleuth. He was active in or headed the SEC investigations that led to charges being filed against such celebrated operators as Lowell Birrell, Eddie Gilbert, Louis Wolfson, Robert Vesco and Bernard Cornfield.• When tremendous pressurewas brought on the SEC to allow Cornfield to sell mutual funds in the U.S., Pollack said no-and likely saved countlessmillions for American investors. Recently Pollack directed the SEC's investigation of Financier C. Arnholt Smith, Nixon's longtime friend and financial backer, who ha.~been charged with fleecing $100 million from the stockholders of a San Diego-basedconglomerate, Westgate-California Corp. Pollack did not know about the Nixon connection until he read about it in the newspaperswhen the investigation was well under way. Casually, Pollack asked his staff: "Is this guy the C. Arnholt Smith?" Told that he was, Pollack simply shruggedand went back to work. [From the Boeton Globe] A GOOD APPOINTMENT In naming Irving M . Pollack to the Federal Securities and Exchange Commission President Nixon has made a sensible selection for a difficult task. Pollack, who is chief of the SEC's enforcement division and has been on the staff in one capacity or another for 27 years, knows the industry well and is not its servant. This is important for a reltulator. One would not expect Mr. Nixon, apart from the need to name a Democrat to the vacancy on the SEC, to pick a man who has achieved a reputation in the industry for being a tough cookie. During the 1968election Mr. Nixon complained about "heavy-handed regulation" by the SEC, a vague complaint but one that miltht eaaily have encompassedMr. Pollack's activities. fndee?~the securities industry has developed a perceptible senseof hostility toward .:.\1r.Pollack, and it will be refreshing to have the Senateconsidera regulatory nominee who cannot be accused of merely repre!'enting its interests-the kind of charge leveled sometimes unfairly but under!'tnndably when a man emergesfrom the regulated industry itself. Mr. Nixon's preoccupation with other issues may have led him to take this sensiblestep becauseit is easy. Mr. Pollack enjoys the support of SEC Chairman Ray Garrett Jr., also a Nixon appointee, and this support eliminates the need to hunt for a man who, under other circumstancesmight be more in Mr. Nixon's style. The appointment also suggestsa helpful element in the Watergate dominnted atmosphere of Washington. The regulntory agenciesare in a sense freed from White House interference as Mr. Nixon struggles with other problems and tries to restore public confidence in the integrity of government. The occasion is a sad one, but the result may be healthy. 'fhe CHAIRMAN. Senator Proxmire. Senator PROXMIRE.Well, this is a great day for the President I think. He's made some fine appointments. Dr. Wallich, as I said, is a very distinguished appointment and Mr. Pollack I think is in the 1 Cornfteld, now In a Swiss jail awaiting trial on fraud charges,bad bis ball reducedlaat ,net mlWon to Sl.5 mflllon. rr, WM still unahl• to post it . ·. 29-408-74--2 Digitized by Google from $2.5 8 best traditions. Here's a man who served in the Securities and Exchan~e Commission for more than 20 years with outstanding distinction and had been/romoted to a position of authority on the staff of the Securities an Exchange Commission. I understand you were head of the Division of Enforcement. Mr. POLLACK.Yes, sir. Senator PROXMIRE. That used to be Trading and Markets? Mr. POLLACK. They split it off. The regulationssectionwas made the Division of Market Regulation and they gave all the enforcement functions to the newly created Division of Enforcement. Senator PROXMIRE. As you know, for the last couple years I have been chairman of the subcommittee that handles the appropriations for the Securities and Exchange Commission ond I have had some associationwith your operations then, and, of course,I have been on this committee for 17 years, and I am just delighted to seethis kind of appointment. This is the kind of appointment that I think is very good for our country and for our Government. I might say that I have talked with the staff of Senator Williams who of course has dealt with you very closelyand he joins in his pleasureand strong approval of your appointment and has indicated that he is very pleasedthat the Securitiesand Exchange·Commissionis-it seemsto be about to becomeone of the strongest that we have ever had in our history. Mr. POLLACK.The mail I received has reflected that., Senator. The CHAIRMAN. Senator Brooke. Senator BROOKE.This is· indeed a great day for the President to have Senator Proxmire be so laudatorily in his praise of him. This, in itself, is a most significant day. But I certainly agree with my good friend, Bill Proxmire, in all the things he has to say. Moreover, I want to add that the chairman of the Securities Subcommittee, Senator Williams also joins in support of the comments of the Senator from Wisconsin. Unfortunately he couldn't be present on this occasion. Mr. Pollack, Senator Proxmire and I conducted a hearing of the Appropriations Committee at which you appeared. Your forthrightness,your obvious integrity, and your knowledge of the Commission was something that brought joy to both of our hearts at that time and certainly assuredus the Commissionhad some very able membersof the staff. The fact that the President elevatesyou to the position of SEC commissionerafter some27 years at the Commissionis certainly a highlight of your careerin the Securitiesand ExchangeCommission. I received a letter from a Raymond W. Cocchi and he said: "Our Nation's 340 million investors and the 3,000securitiesfirms operating outside of Wall Street will benefit from the tough but fair policy and the enormous practical experience that Mr. Pollack will add to the Commission." I think those words are certainly well spoken. I also refer to the Boston Globe editorial, a newspaper which is the largest in New England which is not always favorable to the President and his appointments, and it speaks very highly of your appointment, and I could go on with many others; but suffice it to say that I know your feelings and vour views for the small investor. I know that you are very knowledgeableabout the industry itself, the internal wo;rkingsof th~ SEC, and I think that you come at a time when this post representsa great challenge to you personally and a great opportunity for true servicewhich con help to restore the industry which is so vital to our Nation. Digitized by Google So I welcome you and look forward as ranking member of the Securities Subcommittee to working with you and I'm ju~t pleased as punc4 that the President saw fit to appoint you to this high post. Senator PROXMIRE.Mr. Chairman, would the Senator yield for 1 minute? · I, unfortunately, have to leave right now for another hearing and I would like to say that I don't, unfortunately, know Mr. Van Gorkom, although I am most impressedby his resume.He obviously is a man of very distinguished back~round. I might say that he also comes from my little town where I grew up and lived until I was 30 years old before I carpetbaggedinto Wisconsin,so I'm very happy that the President has chosento appoint a Lake Forester. The CHAIRMAN.Did you say "carpetbag?" .. Senator PROXMIRE. I carpetbaggedinto Wisconsin. I did indeed. The CHAIR:\IAN.Senator Brock. Senator BROCK.Mr. Pollack, I'm sorry I missed you yesterday. I know you had a chance to visit my assistant. I would like to pursue one of the matters he raised with you just a little bit with regard to your f eelin~son fixed rates or negotiated rate commissions and the level at which we make that breakpoint, if any. I'd like your thoughts on that. Mr. PoLLACK.Well, speaking generally on the fixed rates, I think that our hearings and our studies indicated that the markets would be better off with competitive rates. Unfortunately, of course, the market hasoperatedfor some200years under fixed rates and therefore the question is how you place the minimum. The Commission'sYiew originally was to allow IO-percentdiscount from the fixed commission that allowed the people to use their ingenuity. More recently we have determined,I believe, to allow them to sttLrt from the bottom and work up. The purposeis to attempt to give the industry an opportunity to experiment with the new pricing package or schedule so that they can adapt to the ultimate elimination of fixed rates which are scheduled for 1975. I should say, secondly, that our hearingsindicated that becauseof the heterogeneousnature of the securities industry it is not possible really to establish fixed rates for it as you would for a public utility. SenatorBROCK.I gather you are not concernedabout the potential adverseimpact on the total elimination of fixed rates on what I would refer to as regional firms. Mr. PoLLACK.I think the Commissionis concernedon what impaets there will be. I think the judgment is that the regional firms, because of the nature of the service that is provided, will be in a favorable or as favorable position as they are now, if not more so, becaw;e the regional firm will have a flexibility in competing with national wire housesin terms of setting rates in their own regionswhile the national wire housesin my own view undoubtedly have to go for a nationwide rate. In addition, they would be able to modify the services that they offer or the combination of services thay they offer in order to give more effective competition than they have been able to do somewhat in the past. Indeed, in our hearingsit was suggestedthat the fixed rate combination of the so-called give-ups .that institutions gave to firms madeit possiblefor the larger houseswho were able to exercise greater leverage to move into some of the smaller cities and offer competition which previously they were unable to do. Digitized by Google So the judgment is that the regional firms will come out of this all right. I know that many of the regional firms are concernedabout it. I have talked with someof them. But I feel that my own judgment is that they will be able to remain competitive in this market. Senator BROCK.You don't fear or foreseea situation where a national housecould establish different regional rates in order to eliminate competition in a region-by-regionbasis? Mr. POLLACK.I think that would violate the antitrust laws, if I understand them. Senator BROCK.~~okou? Mr. PoLLACK.It · the differential pricing to drive out somebody in a local area-Senator BROCK. You know you can always justify differential pricing from a competitive point of view and that's allowed. Mr. PoLLACK.Well, I'm talking to the practical element. I think it's very difficult for a large house to establish one rate in Tennessee, for example,and another one in Kentucky with the easeof communication. You could do that years ago when there wasn't the communication that you have today. But, where today somebodycan just lift up the phone and call the broker anywherein this country free on the WATS line, I don't see how the national housescan do differential pricing in the various States and regions. SenatorBROCK.What percent of national listings on the New York Stock Exchange-what percent of the stocks are there actually traded on the floor? In other words, how much is traded outside of the market? Mr. PoLLACK.Are you referring to the third market? Senator BROCK.Yes. Mr. PoLLACK.The last figure was somewherein between 7 or 8 percent, in that neighborhood. SenatorBROCK.You don't considerthat a problem? Mr. POLLACK.No. I think that the third market competition has served to spur the exchangeto take on new developmentsthat possibly would not have occurredwithout this outsidecompetitive factor. SenatorBROCK.Thank you. The CHAIRMAN. Senator Weicker. Senator WEICKER.Mr. Chairman, I had the opportunity of meeting with :Mr. Pollack yesterday and indeed I am very impressedby his background, by what he's accomplishedto date and I have no doubt in my mind that h~ ~ill bring a high degree of intelligence and integrity to the Comrmss10n. However, Mr. Pollack, I wonder if I just might ask a few questions relnti,·e to that period of time when you headed up the Enforcement Division as the Director of the Enforcement Division of SEC. It was during that time of controversy, if you ,dll, that we have since heard about relative to the transfer of ITT files to the JusticeDepartment. Were you-I say that in the strictest senseof the word-were you consultedrelative to that transfer? Mr. POLLACK. No, not at the time that the transfer took place. Senator WEICKER.The actual files themselves,were these within the Enforcement Division? Mr. POLLACK.Yes. My staff was conducting a subsequentinquiry after we had completed the first injunctive suit against ITT. We learned from newspaperreports that certain documentshad not been Digitized by Google 11 produced pursuant to a subpena served in our earlier inquiry. :-.1y deputy, Mr. Sporkin, upon learning this, called counsel and inquired why the records had not been produced and asked counsel to make suitable inquiry. Thereafter, counsel came down with certain records that hadn't been produced and wished to tender them but with a string attached that we might return them on the theory that he believed they were not within the subpena. Mr. Sporkin declined to do so and at that time my recollection is he consulted with me and I agreed ,vith him that we would not take them under any restrictive conditions. In addition, eachone of us apparently independently advised counsel becauseof the time period in which this was occurring that we felt that it was appropriate for him not only to deliver the documents to us, which we had not seen I might say at the time, but also to the SenateJudiciary Committee that was engagedin the inquiry involving ITT at that point. · I was subsequently advised by Mr . Sporkin that he had been advised by counsel that such a tender had been made but had been declined by the committee or its chairman. Senator WEICKER.Insofar as October 6-or rather, the 5th and 6th of October-when did you receive the first information t.lrnt these matters should be transferred to the Justice Department? 1'fr. POLLACK.When Mr. Sporkin advised me either on the 5ththey were transferred on the 6th, I think-it was either 1 or 2 days before they were transferred becm,se a question arose as to: (1) whether we would proceed with our inquiry; snd (2) if we did, what warning would we give to the witness in addition to our usual one. Senator WEICKER.Which brings me to the next question. Were you in the middle of an investigation yours<>lvesrelative to ITT? · ~fr . POLLACK.We were engagedin one aspect of the inquiry that ,ve were conducting. We had previou,-ly suggestedto Justice that: \\·eat least Mr. Sporkin had talked I think on two occasionsto themsuggesting that we felt a grand jury inquiry might be preferable to our inquiry. They . declined at that time and so we pidn,d up the inquiry that we were then conducting on the 4th or 5th of October when the transfer of records took place. Senator WEICKER.So t,hat when the request from Justi ce cnme about for the files to be transferred to Justice, you were in the middle · of an inquiry? Mr. POLLACK . "vVewere. Senator \VEICKER. Did that require, in your mind, some action insofar as the persons that you were questioning relative to the inquiry, specifically the ITT people or whoever else \\·as involved? Mr. POLLACK.Y cs, it did, Senator, becausevou remind me that I think the stnff at that time told me-I didn,.t know that beforethat the people had questioned our proceeding when tlwy kne"· that some inquiry purportedly was also going on in Justice eovering roughly the samegeneral area. So when we transferred the records, as a matter of fairness, my people raised the question immediately and "·e agreed that the witness should be advised that the Commission had ordered its records transferred to Justice because,ve thought that "·as only fair that they know that. They then declined to proceed to testify once they knew that fact. D1git1zedby Google 12 Senator WEICKER. Was there any consultation between yourself and Mr. Casey during this period of trme in October as to the matter of trasferring the files to Justice? :vli:. POLLACK.No. The matter was being handled by his staff and I beheve the general counsel's office; but there were consultations before Mr. Sporkin had gotten clearance and talked to Justice that I mentioned previously to see whether we couldn't get them to <lo the inquiry. For reasonsthat I don't want to go into in detail, we felt it would be preferable at a point we had reached in our earlier inquiry for the Justice Department to pick up the investigation and conduct it before a grand jury. Senator WEICKER.This was back in August-September? :\fr. POLLACK.Yes, the August-September period. Senator WEICKER.So August-September Justice declined to do that? :\fr. PoLLACK.Correct. Senator WEICKER.And on October 5~ the Justice asked for the files to be turned over to them? :Mr. POLLACK.Yes. The Commission minutes reflect that Justice requested-we weren't at the Commission, but I have seen the Commission's minutes and it's reflected in the hearings at the House, that Justice requested the files. We were directed to prepare, as I recall, a memorandum and to offer them our full assistance.The memorandum was prepared by Mr. Sporkin and his staff. Files were sent to Justice and thereafter Mr. Sporkin communicated with the staff at the Department of Justice becausewe were anxious that the ball not be dropped, and suggested that they proceed promptly to conduct the grand jury investigation and offered our assistanceto them. Senator WEICKER.Did you sign the transmittal letter or did Mr. Sporkin? Mr. POLLACK.The transmittal letter I think was signed by the chairman, if I recall correctly, Senator. I'm not absolutely certain of that. Senator WEICKER.Do you recall a conversation related to the languagein that letter whereby languagewhich said "at your request" referring in other words to the Justice Department, was changed to "it is agreed that the files will be transferred to the Department of Justice?" Mr. PoLLAcx. I only know about that from subsequent readings. I did not know about that at the tii;ne. Senator WEICKER.Were there discussions between Mr. Casey's staff and your staff relative to shifting this over to Justice Department in September-October? Mr. POLLACK.You mean before it occurred? Senator WEICKER.That's right. Mr. PoLJ,ACK.Not that I'm aware of. Senator WEWKER.So, in other words, insofar as input to the decision in October of sending the files to Justice, to the best of your knowledge, you had no such input nor did a member of your staff as it relates to Mr. Casey's staff? I understand the contacts between Mr. Sporkin and Justice. Mr. PoLLACK.Except as I pointed out that the earlier efforts to g3t .Justice to take them-there were conversations between Mr. Sporkin and the Commission. I don't know about Mr. Casey, but there were conversations with respect to that. Digitized by Google 13 Senator WEICKER.I see. And Justice had refused to take them? Mr. POLLACK.That's right. They said they were ~usy enough with what they had. They would prefer not to. And then, Just so I complete the chronology as I understand it, then there were conversations of other people with Justice which we didn't participate in, and the assertion is that they requested the files to be delivered. We were directed to deliver the files. We did. And then I'm advised by my people that shortly thereafter they went over to Justice, Sporkin and the people who worked on the case as I indicated before, to advi<;eJustice that we were anxious that they pick it up promptly and that we assist them in doing whatever we could to complete it as promptly as possible. Senator WEICKER.But the final decision to send the files to Justice was made without consultation with you and was made during the time when you were in the middle of your own investigation. Is that correct? Mr . POLLACK.Yes. We were not at the Commission. That was an ·executivesessionof the Commission when that was made. There was no staff present at that time. Senator WEICKER.I have no further questions, Mr. Chairman. Senator BROCK.May I interject just a question? The CHAIRMAN.Yes. Senator BROCK.Having already established your own intent to transfer , you did that in August and September as I gather, I would ask you if you felt like this wasan unusual procedure then to go ahead and do what you had suggestedin August, to do it in October? Mr. POLLACK.Unusual only in the sense,Senator, that we were in the midst of interrogating the witnesses; so I would say that the timing of it from our point of view was unusual because we had to stop and determine whether we could continue the inquiry which we had originally intended to try to do. We made summaries of the -documents and instructed our people to continue to interrogate the witnesses if they could. The witnesses, as I indicated to Senator W eicker, declined once they knew the files had been referred. So then what would happen normally is Justice would then pick up the witnessesthat declined to us in the grand jury and we would be able to ,assist them. Senator BROCK.But in the senseit was not a break in the pattern that you had already established-you had desired to transfer them at another tim~-it was not an upsetting of your rights and prerogatives and interests in getting the investigation resolved? Mr. POLLACK.Mr. Sporkin's preference,as I indicated earlier, was to refer these fil es to Justice. For various reasonswe felt the inquiry ·could be better handled and more expeditiously handled by Justice. It was just the timing that I say was unusual becausewe then picked up the inquiry and then when the records were transferred we had to reorient our inquiry to seewhether we could continue to do it; and as I snid, because the witnesses then refused, we concluded ours and offered Justice our assistancein continuing the inquiry. Senator BROCK.But you don't seethat would have any debilitating effect on the inquiry itself, do vou? Mr. POLLACK.No, except to~the extent that we were in the midst of an inquiry nnd we had to tnrn it over to them. Senator BROCK . So they could pursue it? Mr. PoLLACK.Yes. Digitized by Google 14 Senator BROOKE.Mr. Chairman, if I may, Mr. Pollack, there is nothing irregular about the SEC conducting an investigation and the Justice Department conducting an investigation and the congressional committee conducting the inquiry on the same subject matter ut the. same time, is there? Mr. POLLACK.No, sir. Senator BROOKE.And this, in effect, was true concerning the ITT case? Mr. PoLLACK.Correct Senator BROOKE.Now, at some time the congressionalcommittee requestedof the SEC that files be turned over to them. Is that correct? Mr. POLLACK.Right, sir . Senator BROOKE.Now at some time, to your knowledge, did the Commission take a vote as to whether they should turn those files onr to the congressionalcommittee? Mr. PoLLACK.Yes, sir. Senator BROOKE.And what was the result of that vote? Mr. Pot.LACK.Thl:'y declined to turn them over to the congressional' committee. Senator BROOKE.Do vou recall whether that was a unanimous vote of the Commission? • Mr. PoLLACK.It was. Senator BROOKE.It was. And you had knowledge of it at the time. Is that correct? Mr. PoLLACK.Y cs, sir. Senator BaooKE. Now at some time the Justice Department requested those files be turned over to them. Is that correct? Mr. POLLACK.Yes, sir. Senator BaooKE. And again, was there a vote taken by the Commission as to whether thev would turn over those files? Mr. POLLACK . Yes, sir.· Senator BHOOKE.And what was the result of that vote? Mr. PoLLACK.Unanimous to turn them over to the Department of Justice with the direction to us (1) to prPpare the memorandum I referred to, Senator, and (2) to cooperate folly with the Department of Justice in their inquiry. Senator BROOKE.So the decision not to turn over the files to the congressionalcommittee and the decision to turn over the files to the Justice Department were not decisions arrived at independently or made independently by the Chairman of the Commission, Mr. Casey. Is that correct? Mr. PoLLACK.That's right, sir . Senator BROOKE.And in bJth instances these were issues raised before the Commission, voted upon, und ultimately resolved unanimously by the Commission? Mr. PoLLACK.Yes, sir. Senator BROOKE.Did you at any time object or voice any objection or did yottr particular division voice any objection to the Commission relative to its refusal to turn over the files to the congressionalcommittee? Mr. PoLLACK.No, sir. Senator BnooKE. Did you make any recommendation as to whether those files should be turned over to the congressionalcommittee? Digitized by Google 15 Mr. PoLLACK.I'm not sure of that. I think Mr. Sporkin may have indicated that he preferred that we not turn them over but that the people obtain them from the company. I should explain that I think there was an unfortuate misunderstanding here, Senator Brooke. I think people thought that we had documents that were irreplaceable. In fact, these were documents which the company ha<l-the originals or the copies, I don't remember no,v-and so I think becauseof our inquiry Mr. Sporkin had expressedthe view-and I'm doing this from testimony that he gave at hearings-that he would prefer that the committee get them from the company, ITT, so as not to get into our investigatory file. Senator BROOKE.Did you make a recommendation to the. Commission as to whether they should turn over the files to the Justice Department? Mr. PoLLACK.That was made, as I indicated earlier, by Mr. Sporkin, that we should, in either August or September-I don't remember the date, Senator-on the basis that we felt that the inquiry would be better pursued in certain elements of it by the Justice Department rather than we. Senator BROOKE.As I pointed out, you have been in the Commission for 27 years. If you know, and only if you know, is there any precedent or was there any violation of any precedent by the failure of the Commission to turn over these files to the congressionalcommittee? Mr . PoLLACK.I don't know that. I don't know the answer to that. Senator BROOKE.Is it usual procedure to turn over the files to the Justice Department when the Justice Department makes such a request? Mr. POLLACK.Yes, sir. Senator BROOKE.In fact, you have done this on many occasions? Mr. PoLLACK.Yes, sir. Senator BROOKE.And you find nothing irregular in the action of the ·Commission, nothing unusual in the action of the Commission, both in the refusal to turn them over to the congressionalcommittee or the agreement to turn them over to and the fact of turning them over to the Justice Department? Mr. POLLACK.No, sir, except as I have previo11slystated. The CHAIR:\IAN.Gentlemen, I'd like to make this suggestion. These queries have nothing to do with Mr. Pollack's qualification for office. ·They relate to an entirely different matter that may be before HS at a htter date, and I don't see that we should continue this line of questioning. They have nothing to do with the qualifications of this man to serve as a member of the Securities and Exchange Commission and I'd like to sug~est that we withhold further questions on these matters. Senator WEICKER.Mr. Chairman, I have to disa~ree with you. I disagreebecause,as I've indicated, I think he's superbly qualified and has absolute integrity. The CHAIRMAN.That's the only thing at issue before us. Senator WEICKER.But Mr. Pollack is before us, and; in} is present <·apaeityas Dire('tor of the Enfor('ement Division of tie SEC, he was involved, knowingly or unknowingly, in a matter which is of somecon.1·ern to me, if not to others. All I'm trying to do is to relate to his own knowledge, which apparently was very small indeed, relative to the :adual tr'anf-frr; and I think it rather extraordinary that the knowledge . Digitized by Google 16 was that small considering the fact that he was director of that par-ticular bureau. I think he should have been consulted before an investigation which he was conducting was halted. The CHAIRMAN.But does that bear upon his fitne ss to hold this office? That's what's before us. Senator WEICKER. It does to the extent that Mr. Pollack was doing everything he should be doing, if you will. That's all I want to establish. I'm not roing to get into any other individuals that are im·olved except to establish that he was conducting his office as it should hoxe been conducted. I think that's important to have. The CHAIRMAN.Yes. I agree with you. Senator WEICKER.That's it. The CHAIRMAN.That doesgo to his fitness to hold the office, relating only to that, but it seems to me it's gone rather afield. Anyhow, goahead, anyone that has any questions. Senator BROOKE.I have no further questions. Tne CHAIR:\IAN.Senator Brock? Senator BROCK.Nothing. The CHAIRMAN.Senator Weicker? Senator WEICKER.I have no further questions. The CHAIRMAN . Senator Biden? Senator BmE:-r. Just a comment, Mr . Pollack . I'm very pleased tosee that you have been nominated and you have my wholehearted support. I am in complete agreement with Senator Weicker. You are a man of absolute integrity and you are superbly qualified. I'm delighted to have an opportunity to vote in favor of your nomination. Senator BROOKE . l\fr. Chairman, Senator Tower would like to be recorded as supporting the confirmation. The CnAIR~IAN.Thank you. By the way, I overlooked saying thnt Mr . Pollack has the endorsement of both Senators from Maryland, and l\.fr . Van Gorkom has the endorsement from both Senators from Illinois. I did announce that Dr. Wallich had the endorsementof l:oth Senators from Connecticut. Mr . PoLLACK.Mr. Chairman, I just may say I received so many flattering comments I think it would be remiss if I didn't state that . in large measure many of these should be credited to my associates, staff, and the Commission which have both given me the ability to carry on and done a lot of the work for which very frequently the direct.qr gets credit but really doesn't do. I would also like · to take the opportunity to say that my wife and f~mily have en<lured a lot of personal sacrifices and I think they nro pleased that this has arrived. The CHAIRMAN.I think we can all testify to that from our own experiences. 'l'he CHAIRMAN.Let me sav to all of those ·who have been nominated this morning, your financial statements are available to the members of the committee here in the committee room. Then they ,vill be locked up in our safe and kept there for the duration of your office and 1 year beyond. Mr. Van Gorkom, we do have your financial statement? Mr. VAN GonKoM. Yes. The CHAIRMAN.And I believe it's certified by the general counsel? D1git1zedby Google 17 Mr. VAN GoRKO~L Yes. The CHAIR).!AN. And will you tell this committee whether or not you have any holdings or uny interest that would constitute a conflict-in interest in connection with your duties in this office if you are confirmed? Mr. VAN GoRK0:-.1. None whatsoever that I know of. The CHAIR'.\!AN. I will ask you the formal question: If you ore confirmed to this office, will you respond to requests from this committee and any other appropriate committee of Congress to appear and testify freely without reservation? · l\fr. VAN GoRK0:>.1. I certainly ,vill. The CHAIR:-.tAN. Senator Brooke? Senator BROOKE. Nothing other than I have read your resume and I think you are ably qualified for this job, Mr. Von Gorkom, and again, as I said earlier, Senator Proxmire, it's three out of three excellent appointments and yours certainly is an excellent appointment. I am particularly pleased that you're interested in opera. I served as president of the Boston Opera Company for 5 years so we're opera buff:;; together. Any man who loves opera certainly is going to perform a good job. I wish you wdl and Senator Tower also couldn't be here this morning and he knows of your qualifications and he supports your appointment and we both congratulate the President on the quality of your appointment. The CHAIR:.tAN . I will say that your biogrcphical sketch will be made a part of the record. [Biographical sketch follows:) BIOGRAPHICAL SK~:TCH OF J, \V, VAN GORKOM !\Ir. Van Gorkom wa.<i born in 1917. He attended the University of Illinois 11.nd received his Bachelor of Science degree in 1939, his J.D. in 1941 and his C.P.A. certificate in 1!)50. He wa.-, admitted to the Illinois Bar in 1941. Aftrr the completion of four years of Navy duty during World War II, Mr. Van Gorkom joined the Chicago law firm of KixMiller Baar & Morris, which specialized in federal taxation. In 1947 he joined the accounting firm of Arthur Andersen & Co. He was elected a partner of the firm in 1954. J. W. Vari Gorkom joined Trans Union Corporation in 1956 when he accepti>d the position of c:mtroller. He was elected to the corporation's Board of Director>< in 19;>7, and was made a vice president in 1958. He was named executive vice president in 1960 and became pre:iident in 1963. Mr. Van Gorkom has served a.'l t,reasurer, president and chairman of the board of the Chicago Lyric Opera Association. He currently is vice chairman of the board of the Association. He is a member of the Board of Trustees of Loyola and the University of Notre Dame, the Council of the University of Chicago's Graduate School of Business, and the University of Chicago Citizens Board. He is a member of the Board of Directors and Chairman of the Investment Committee of Chicago Community Ventures, Inc.1• the nation's largest MESBIC (Minority Enterprise Small Businesg Investment Co.) . Mr. Van Gorkom is a director of Stepan Chemical Company; Scott, Foresman & Co.; the National Boulevard Bank of Chicago; the Illinois Central Industries; Illinois Central Gulf Railroad; and Midas-International Corporation. He is a member of the Board of Advisors of Mercy Hospital, Board of Trustees of Michael R eese Hospital and Medical Center, the Chicago Club, Commercial Club, Mid-America Club, Onwentsia Club, Union League Club, and Old Elm. Mr. Van Gorkom is married to the former Betty Jean Alexander. They have two daughters, Gayle and Lynne. The Van Gorkoms Jive at 908 Ringwood Road in Lake J!'orcst, lllmo1s. Digitized by Google 18 The CHAIRMAN. Senator Biden? Senator BrnEN. I have no questions. I have no objection whatsoever a nd from what I have heard of and read in the resume, I think you .are very well qualified. The CHAIRMAN. Senator Brock? Senator BROCK. No questions, I wish you well. The CHAIRMAN. Senator Weicker? Senator WEICKER. No ques tions, Just good luck. The CHAIRMAN. May I say th at Senator Williams, who is chairman of our Securities Subcommittee and who's had a great deal to do with settino- up the office of which you will be a part, is not able to be here this morning but I am informed that he strongly supports this nomination. Thank you very much. We congratulate you and wish you well, all of you. l\fr. VAN GoRKOM. Thank yon very much. The CHAIRMAN. Now I wonder if we may change the rules just a littl e bit and vote on these now so we can turn them in and hope to get them confirmed. Senator BROOKE. I move we confirm all three nominations. The CHAIRMAN. Without objection it is so ordered. [Whereupon, at 10:25 a.m., the hearing was adjourned.] 0 ,~ . ),g,:,7e,; . c" u o::,g le