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CCAC Public Meeting
OF
DEPARTMENT OF THE TREASURY
US Mint
Thursday, November 17, 2016
12:01 p.m.

Department of the Treasury
US Mint
801 9th Street, NW
Washington, D.C. 20220
(202) 354-7371

Reported by:

Nate Riveness
Capital Reporting Company

A P P E A R A N C E S
US Mint:

April Stafford

Greg Weinman
Michael White
Betty Birdsong
Roger Vasquez
Pam Borer
Vanessa Franck
Megan Sullivan
Andy Tran
*************
Tom Uram
Mary Lannin
Heidi Wastweet
Dennis Tucker
Michael Moran
Donald Scarinci
Robert Hoge
Jeanne Stevens-Sollman
Jennifer Woodworth
Don Everhart

Press:
Mike Unser, CoinNews

P R O C E E D I N G S
MS. LANNIN:

So it is 9:02.

Good morning.

I call to order this meeting of the Citizens Planning
Advisory Committee for November 17th, 2016.

The

members of the Committee who have confirmed their
attendance are Robert Hoge, Jeanne Stevens-Sollman,
Dennis Tucker, Heidi Wastweet, Mike Moran and myself,
Mary Lannin.
During this session, the Committee will
consider the following item, the review and discussion
of candidate designs for the Secretary of the
Treasury, Jacob J. Lew.

And before we begin our

proceedings, are there members of the press on the
phone?
MR. UNSER:

Mike Unser with CoinNews.

MS. LANNIN:
else?

Good morning, Mike.

That appears to be all.

Don Everhart.

Anyone

It seems that I heard

Is that correct?

MR. EVERHART:
MS. LANNIN:
MR. WEINMAN:
MS. LANNIN:

That is correct.
And Greg?
Yeah, we can take -And Betty?

MS. BIRDSONG:
MR. WEINMAN:

Yes.

I'm here.

We can take a roll call or let

you know who's around the table here at the Mint.
MS. LANNIN:

Okay, thank you, please.

MS. STAFFORD:

April Stafford.

MS. SULLIVAN:

Megan Sullivan.

MR. WHITE:

Michael White.

MS. BIRDSONG:
MS. FRANK:

Vanessa Frank.

MR. VASQUEZ:

Roger Vasquez.

MS. LANNIN:
kind of far away.

Betty Birdsong.

I'm sorry.

Vanessa?

You're

All right.

MR. VASQUEZ:
MS. LANNIN:

Roger Vasquez.

MR. VASQUEZ:

Good morning, Roger.

MS. BORER:
MS. LANNIN:

Good morning.
Pam Borer.
I'm sorry.

I couldn't hear the

last one.
MS. BORER:
MS. LANNIN:
MS. BORER:
Management team, Mary.

And Pam Borer, the entire -Oh, hi, Pam.
Yeah, the entire Design

MR. WEINMAN:

From the legal office, Greg

Weinman and Andy Tran, who is our law student who is
with us.
MS. LANNIN:

All right.

And is Steven

Antonucci here by any chance?
MS. WOODWORTH:
Woodworth.

He is not, but I am Jennifer

I'm the new design integrating manager

here.
MS. LANNIN:

Welcome, Jennifer.

MS. WOODWORTH:
MS. LANNIN:

Thank you.

Okay.

All right.

For the new

staff, do we have any issues that need to be addressed
about striking this medal for Secretary of the
Treasury?
MS. STAFFORD:

Well, from the administrative

standpoint, I would just like to let everyone on this
call know that we have a transcriber here, so as we
have the discussion in the meeting, if you please
could state your name, that would help greatly.

Also

for anyone who is on the call, if you could mute your
phone while you are not talking, that would help as
well.

We do not have anything from the program
office side regarding technical items regarding the
striking of this medal.

Jennifer or Don, is there

anything you'd like to note?

I think it's our

standard bronze medal.
MR. EVERHART:

I have nothing.

MS. STAFFORD:

Okay.

MS. WOODWORTH:

This is Don.

This is Jennifer, nothing

from me, either.
MS. STAFFORD:
begin.

All right.

Mary?
MS. LANNIN:

hello?

So we're good to

Okay.

So the first item --

Did someone just join us?
MS. STAFFORD:

No.

MS. SULLIVAN:

No.

MS. LANNIN:

Oh.

Okay.

The first item on

our agenda is the discussion of the Secretary and the
minutes from our previous meeting.

Those items were

included in the materials emailed for members of the
committee to review.
documents?

Are there any comments on the

Hello?
MS. BIRDSONG:

There are no comments.

MS. LANNIN:

Hello?

MR. WEINMAN:

Hello?

Apparently there are no

comments.
MS. LANNIN:

Okay.

Hearing no further

discussion, I move to approve the minutes and the
letters of Secretary.
MR. URAM:

Second, Tom Uram.

MS. LANNIN:

Okay.

those in favor, say yes.

Thank you, Tom.

All

All those opposed, say no.

(YES)
MS. LANNIN:

So it appears to be unanimous,

right?
SPEAKER:

Yes.

MS. LANNIN:

That's correct.

Okay.

So, now

I'd like to turn to April Stafford, the manager of the
new design management group, to present the portfolio
for Secretary of the Treasury, Jacob J. Lew.
MS. BIRDSONG:

April?

Mary, Megan's going to fill

in for April, I believe.
MR. WEINMAN:

She had to step out of the

room for a moment.
MS. SULLIVAN:

She had to step out of the

room, so I will begin.

As part of its bronze medals

portfolio, the United States Mint produces Secretary
of the Treasury medals to commemorate the secretaries
and their legacies.

The medals typically feature

portraits of the secretary and the beginning dates of
their terms.
Reverse elements often include symbols,
seals and quotes.

The United States Mint worked

closely with the Secretary staff in development of
these designs.
MS. STAFFORD:

Thank you, Megan, and let me

just before I go live, I appreciate it.

That was

actually Donald Scarinci's assistant calling.
endeavoring to call in.

He is

I let him know we had a

quorum, but nevertheless, he is still, we're
confirming the number with him and he is trying to
join us.

So there may be someone adding in to the

call in a moment.
MS. LANNIN:

Okay.

So that was all the

funny noise that we were hearing.
MS. STAFFORD:

Okay.

So we will start with

review of the obverse designs.

Obverse design number

1 and 1A both portray Secretary Lew with an American
flag billowing in the background and the inscription,
Jacob J. Lew.
Design 1 features the date Secretary Lew was
sworn into office, February 28, 2013, and Design 1A
features a banner with the inscription 76th Secretary
of the Treasury.

I should note that Design 1A is the

preferred obverse at present of Secretary Lew.
Obverse 2 and 2A feature a portrait of
Secretary Lew in semi-profile, framed by an American
flag with the inscription Jacob J. Lew.

Design 2A

contains a banner with the inscriptions 76th Secretary
of the Treasury.
Moving on to the reverses, Reverse 1 depicts
the fa├žade of the Department of the Treasury Building.
The inscription reads 76th Secretary of the Treasury,
and Secretary Lew's signature is featured in an
exergue.

Reverse 2 features the Treasury seal.

Reverse 3 depicts the main building on Ellis Island,
which opened in 1900.
Secretary Lew's father immigrated to the
United States through Ellis Island.

As such, the

gateway and its symbols of liberty hold considerable
meaning to him both personally and as a committed
public servant professionally.

Design 3 also features

the Treasury seal and the inscriptions February 28th,
2013 and 76th Secretary of the Treasury.
Reverse Design 4 features a quote by Abraham
Lincoln next to the Statue of Liberty.

The quote

reads, "I leave you hoping that the lamp of liberty
will burn in your bosoms until there shall no longer
be a doubt that all men are created free and equal."
The inscription, Abraham Lincoln appears across the
exergue.
I will note at this time that for the
reverse design, the Secretary likes both Design 4,
which we just discussed, as well as Design 5, which I
will read the design description for in a moment, but
still would like to hear the CCAC and CFA's feedback
before making a final decision.
Moving on to Reverse 5, this design
showcases elements from Design 3 and 4 with a quote by
Harriet Tubman next to the Statue of Liberty.

The

quote reads, "I would fight for liberty so long as my

strength lasted."

The inscription Harriet Tubman sits

below the design element of the main building on Ellis
Island.
That is all of the designs.
there are any questions.

Madam Chair, if

Otherwise, we can begin

discussion.
MS. LANNIN:

Thank you so much, April.

I

know that my least favorite form of meeting is a
telephonic meeting and I tend to agree with that.
MR. SCARINCI:
MS. LANNIN:

I'm here.
Okay, Donald, awesome.

I would

like to indulge you all by telling you, by expressing
what I find to be of interest in this portfolio rather
than my sort of traditional wrap-up at the end.

I

like Design 1A, which is what Secretary Lew wants
because it actually says Secretary of the Treasury on
it and the date may be not as meaningful to someone
who had purchased it.
My favorite for the reverse is Reverse No. 5
because it combines a small amount of text, but it's
important that the text by Harriet Tubman, which I
think is a nod to the changes afoot at the Treasury

for the redesign of our currency.

It also has the

Ellis Island building on it, which is said to be
important to Lew.

So my personal feelings would be

that I would vote for 1A and 5, and I want to call on
everybody else in turn, so Donald, I know you're busy.
What do you think?
MR. SCARINCI:

I agree with you and I think

that there's no one more deserving of this medal that
Martin Lew.

He's really extended himself, you know,

and really done a great service to the country and
really what his role is as the coin is almost
miniscule compared to his role in the nation's economy
and where this country has gone under his tutelage.
So if he is happy with the obverse, then I
completely support the obverse and as between the two
reverse designs, if he's asking, if he's following it
back to us for our opinion about the two reverse
designs, I agree with you, Mary, for all of the
reasons that you stated.
MS. LANNIN:

Thank you, Donald.

Robert

Hoge.
MR. HOGE:

Thank you, Mary.

I'm in full

agreement with you and with Donald.
MS. LANNIN:

Jeanne.

MS. STEVENS-SOLLMAN:
1A.

I agree totally with

I think it's a very good likeness.

I love the

billowing flag and I believe that it would strike up
nicely.

I'm a little concerned on Reverse 5 with the

Ellis Island building.

Although I think it's really

wonderful, I'm not sure if that's just too much
information.

Otherwise, I will agree with that one.

MS. LANNIN:

Thank you, Jeanne.

MR. TUCKER:

Thank you, Mary.

Dennis.
I agree with

your very eloquently stated observations about both
the obverse and the reverse.

I have nothing to add to

those except to say that the obverse that Secretary
Lew prefers is actually appears to be based on his
official Treasury Department portrait, so I think
that's another good tie-in.

So I agree with what

you've said and I concur with those recommendations.
MS. LANNIN:
MR. URAM:

Thank you.
I agree.

Tom.

It's very nice.

I

think it will strike up very nicely.
MS. LANNIN:

Do you agree with Number 1 and

1A and 5?
MR. URAM:

1A.

MS. LANNIN:

Correct.

Okay.

Heidi?

While we're

waiting for Heidi, Mike, what do you think?
MR. MORAN:

1A and 5.

MS. WASTWEET:
MS. LANNIN:

Sorry, here I am.

MR. MORAN:

1A and 5?
I don't want to go with 4.

It's

too much inscription.
MS. LANNIN:

Okay.

And Heidi, how about

you?
MS. WASTWEET:

I'm here.

Sorry, I had

trouble with my mute button.
MS. LANNIN:
MS. WASTWEET:

That's okay.

5.

For the reverse, I like the

Artistically I think it flows better.

it's a lot of information.

I think

I think a medal can hold

that much information and I think it will look nice.
On the obverse, as I think Dennis stated, this is
clearly based on his official corporate photograph.
It's visible with the PDF and I think the layout is
fine.

I do have some issues with the drawing itself.

I think it exaggerates too much his jowls and there's
some other inaccuracies, so what I would like to
suggest is that the Mint allow the sculpture to work
from the photograph and not rely so heavily on this
drawing.
MS. LANNIN:

Is that permissible?

Greg and

Don?
MR. WEINMAN:
permissible.

Well, certainly it's

I think that -- I mean, obviously if

it's based on the photograph, then it's logical that
the sculpture would utilize the source material for it
as well, especially as much as it's an official photo.
MS. LANNIN:
MS. WASTWEET:

Okay.
I'm just suggesting going one

step beyond using the photograph as backup but more as
primary information.
MR. WEINMAN:
walk a line there.

I think yeah, I probably -- we

So that we're actually showing the

designs that are going to be the basis for the medal
to both committees and we don't have to go back, I
don't think, I mean I think in this particular
situation, I don't know that I'd necessarily use the

photograph, use the words.

We're going to use the

photograph as the basis, unless of course the CCAC's
recommendation is use the photograph.
MS. STAFFORD:

So Don, maybe we could have

Don Everhart speak to this.

Don, you understand how

designers will use reference material to aid in their
sculpts.

You don't see that there'd be any problem in

addressing Heidi's concerns, do you?
MR. EVERHART:

No, not at all.

I know that

the artist did use that as a reference point and I'm
sure that they intend to use that when the sculpting
begins.
MS. LANNIN:

So what is the feeling about

actually voting on 1A with Heidi's suggestion that the
photograph be used?
MR. HOGE:
MS. LANNIN:

Mary, this is Robert Hoge.

MR. HOGE:

Oh, hi, Robert.
I would like to make one

observation, actually two brief ones.

First of all,

in every image of Secretary Lew that I have seen, and
I make this observation as a lifelong wearer of
glasses, his spectacles have very dark frames and in

the images given to us by the artist, the frames are
shown in a very light color, which is either
inaccurate or misleading.

That's something that the

artist might want to take into account as well.
MS. LANNIN:
MR. HOGE:

Okay.
Also I think that the design of

the flag in the background, while very appealing and
I'm not against it, I'm afraid here again we see an
artist working with the idea of a drawing rather than
a sculpt.

Now, this can certainly be done, but I

think it's not a very effective way of presenting the
flag.

Just my observation.
MS. LANNIN:

what Robert said?
discussion.

Thank you.

Okay.

Okay.

Any other comments on

I don't hear any further

I'd like to ask the Committee to vote on

the designs and it seems that we have picked 1A and 5
as an obverse and a reverse.

Hello?

I'm hearing all

these clicks.
So in terms of that combination, Donald?
Would you vote for 1A and 5?
MR. SCARINCI:
MS. LANNIN:

Yes.
Okay.

Robert?

MR. HOGE:

Yes.

MS. LANNIN:

Jeanne?

MS. STEVENS-SOLLMAN:
MS. LANNIN:

Dennis?

MR. TUCKER:

Yes.

MS. LANNIN:

Thomas?

Yes.

MR. URAM:

Yes.

MS. LANNIN:

Heidi?

MS. WASTWEET:
MS. LANNIN:
MR. MORAN:
MS. LANNIN:

Yes.
Mike?

Yes.
Okay.

So the vote is unanimous

that we have picked 1A and 5.

Is there any further

discussion about anything?
MR. MORAN:

Mary, this is Mike Moran.

I

think it would be helpful if we instruct the Mint to
provide the transcript to the artist so that they can
see our comment and critique of the portrait, let them
take them and incorporate them.
MS. LANNIN:
ask.

Okay.

That's a fair thing to

I think that that would be in any case done

anyway.

Wouldn't that be correct, Don?

MS. STAFFORD:

Yes.

We will absolutely

ensure that the sculptor has access to this
information.
MS. LANNIN:

right.

Okay.

Well, thank you.

MR. WEINMAN:

Yeah, and the artist.

MS. LANNIN:

And the artist, exactly.

All

It doesn't appear that there's any further

discussion and so than you all for calling in.
there's no further business, I move to adjourn.

If
Is

there a second?
MS. STEVENS-SOLLMAN:
MR. HOGE:

Second.

MS. LANNIN:
very much.

Second.

Second and first.

Thank you

Go back and enjoy your day and let's all

go and order the new gold coin from the Mint.
(WHEREUPON, at 12:20 p.m., the meeting was
adjourned.)

CERTIFICATE OF NOTARY PUBLIC
I, NATE RIVENESS, the officer before whom the
foregoing proceeding was taken, do hereby certify that
the proceedings were recorded by me and thereafter
reduced to typewriting under my direction; that said
proceedings are a true and accurate record to the best
of my knowledge, skills, and ability; that I am
neither counsel for, related to, nor employed by any
of the parties to the action in which this was taken;
and, further, that I am not a relative or employee of
any counsel or attorney employed by the parties
hereto, nor financially or otherwise interested in the
outcome of this action.

NATE RIVENESS
Notary Public in and for the
DISTRICT OF COLUMBIA

CERTIFICATE OF TRANSCRIBER

I, DOROTHY SMITH POUCH, do hereby certify that
this transcript was prepared from audio to the best of
my ability.

I am neither counsel for, related to, nor
employed by any of the parties to this action, nor
financially or otherwise interested in the outcome of
this action.

November 28, 2016

DOROTHY SMITH POUCH